Subtitles out of sync on recorded programs on ABC

[Teddles]

Experimental firmware 7.6-alpha for the V2 up and running (with restored settings/plug ins)

Unfortunately, no joy with recorded programs - subtitles still badly out of sync. Recordings from different channels were tested with the same result; the only exception being SD programs on ABC Kids (LCN22) which were OK.

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

I am at a loss for what to say. My local tester could not reproduce the issues you report on any of his recordings. He was able to reproduce the issue on your recordings and the timing error was reduced when he used the test build.

I wonder how many subtitle options are available to you? Does the issue change if you select any of the other subtitle options?

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

I am at a loss for what to say.

May I suggest you join me in uttering a tirade of expletives

I wonder how many subtitle options are available to you? Does the issue change if you select any of the other subtitle options?

Tinkering so far has been to no avail ... will delve into the options in more detail but realistically I'm not expecting a successful outcome.

Teddles

[BillySilly]

Hi All,

I am also having a problem with subtitles on recorded programs on the Beyonwiz V2 OpenATV 7.5.1. They start off fine but end up about 20-30 seconds in front of the picture. I have used recordings from different channels to test this out and it is consistent. Live viewing doesnt have a problem. I have tried adjusting the subtitle options but that doesn't fix it. It seems like the software is not recognising all of the markers in the subtitle text and jumps to the next one it recognises.

Regards
Bill

[Teddles]

I am also having a problem with subtitles on recorded programs on the Beyonwiz V2 OpenATV 7.5.1.

Bill, what you're experiencing is further validation of a subtitle problem that exists on (some) V2 units. Notwithstanding the unwavering support of @Iansav in this forum, all attempts to understand/rectify the cause, have to date, been fruitless. I've ultimately come to the conclusion (rightly or wrongly) that it's a bug of some sort in the firmware.

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi All,

I and my tester are in Melbourne receiving signals from the Mt Dandenong transmitters. Can everyone with subtitle issues please post your general location and the transmitter from where you are getting your signal.

Also could you please post the subtitles available on the problematic service(s). For example, here is my ABC HD subtitle options:

In my case the subtitles on 801 and 888 work fine but are non-functional on 8af.

It would also be helpful to see your subtitle settings:

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

Hi Ian,
I'm also located in metro Melbourne/Mt Dandenong transmitters, so I'd expect my details will mirror yours. All HD services suffer the subtitle issue ... I've included 3 of them here for this exercise. Teletext 801 is functional for all, as well as '888' on ABC.

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

While it should make no difference, can you please try changing:
Teletext subtitle colour -> Original
Use original teletext position -> Yes

Perhaps even use the last two of my settings:
Subtitle font size -> 30
Subtitle position -> 40 Pixels

Please also use the standard teletext source of 801.

Let's see if that changes anything.

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

Hi Ian,
Just recorded a snippet of 'Grand Designs Transformations' on ABCTV HD with your settings ... no improvement I'm afraid

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

Do I remember correctly that watching TV live is working okay but recordings have the issue? If so, to what are you saving your recordings?

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

Do I remember correctly that watching TV live is working okay but recordings have the issue? If so, to what are you saving your recordings?

Yep, most often than not, live tv provides proper subtitle function.

I'm saving my recordings to a mounted network share (NAS). I'd given this some thought previously that it might be transcoding the media in the playback process. I haven't pursued this because updates to the NAS (Synology) a year or so ago specifically killed the transcoding feature (or so I thought).

Local storage is in the form of a SD memory card.

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

Do you have a USB Hard Disk you can try? I am looking for something that is significantly fasted than an SD Card or network connection.

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

Do you have a USB Hard Disk you can try?

Yeah, I can set up an external usb drive. I make the point however, that I currently have two other 'duty' V2 units (stock f/w) that use the network share without any subtitle issues.

Will report back,
Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

I am trying to localise the issue.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

@Captain and I have a new theory, what if the newer drivers are the issue. We have been updating the firmware to the latest code. While this improved the situation for some, it has not helped you. We are now investigating if we can go backwards to the drivers used to build the original Beyonwiz firmware. If this is possible then we can run tests on a special OpenATV built on the old driver code to see how that affects the issue.

Depending on if this is something we can do, and if a new test image can be created, then you can run more tests and we can decide the next steps based on the results of further testing.

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

We are now investigating if we can go backwards to the drivers used to build the original Beyonwiz firmware.

Appreciate the efforts, Ian.

BTW, no improvement using local storage in lieu of a NAS.

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

I have a request from another developer. Could you please list all the versions of OpenATV that you have tried that have this subtitle recording issue.

Also, can you suggest a program and a service that you can generally always have an issue with the recordings. I would like to co-ordinate my other tester to make test recordings of the same show on the same channel on his Beyonwiz V2 to see if we can generate a similarly broken recording.

Finally, there is a requested test plan we would like you to try. Can you please try the following test procedure:

1. Please download and install a clean/fresh version of the latest build of OpenATV 6.4. This can be found in the Flash Online menu selection. This should be on a spare slot if you have one available.
2. Install the OpenATV with no plugins, no saved settings, no extra skins. That is, a completely bland version of OpenATV 6.4.
3. Use the Welcome Wizard to perform the basic initialisation and perform the initial service scan.
4. Use a USB connected hard disk for recordings and not the SD Card or a network connection.
5. Use this simple setup to try recording the problematic show on a problematic service.
6. Test this recording and report back if it works correctly or not.
7. If this recording works without any issues then please upgrade that same slot to the latest 7.5.1 OpenATV and again don't restore any settings and just run the basic installation.
8. Use this simple setup to try recording the problematic show and a problematic service.
9. Test this recording and report back if it works correctly or not.

This test procedure will exercise a few options that we have not yet covered.

Is this testing plan achievable?

Regards,
Ian.

[Teddles]

Could you please list all the versions of OpenATV that you have tried that have this subtitle recording issue.

Hi Ian,
As a relatively recent adopter, have just had versions 7.4, 7.5 & 7.5.1. Can't say whether the issue existed with 7.4 as I'd already upgraded to 7.5 before I was made aware of the problem by my better half. She has her own dedicated V2 on stock f/w and just happened to use the oATV unit for one of her recordings. As a general rule, I rarely use subtitles myself.
From V7.5 on, the problem has existed.

Also, can you suggest a program and a service that you can generally always have an issue with the recordings.

Let's settle for 'Planet America' on ABCTV HD (LCN20) on Wednesday and/or Friday nights.

Finally, there is a requested test plan we would like you to try.

Leave it with me Ian.

*Update*
Fallen at the first hurdle unfortunately, V6.4 is exhibiting the same issues!

Teddles

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

That is not bad news. It is exactly what the developers wanted to know. Apparently, the 6.4 firmware has had a very long and stable history. It was hoped that this version would be error free as the changes from 6.4 to the 7.x firmware could have created the issues.

I will check with @Captain to see how he is going building the firmware using the original Beyonwiz drivers.

Regards,
Ian.

[IanSav]

Hi Teddles,

The next series of test drivers are now available for you to try/test. Please refer to this thread to download the file. Simply copy the link from that thread. Login to the V2 and paste the link into the shell and press ENTER. The file will be downloaded and run. You will be presented with a list of drivers that you can test/try. You can check your other Beyonwiz to see which driver date that Beyonwiz is using. I would start with that version of drivers and then keep moving to newer and newer drivers, one at a time until the problem begins. If you can tell us the latest version of the drivers that work we can see what sort of solutions we can create.

I can't run this code so I hope you can understand the instructions. If you need help I will see what I can find out.

Regards,
Ian.